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Welcome to Arizona

May 3, 2010

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(source via Tony B.)

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  1. McG
    May 4, 2010 at 11:14 pm

    Ya know, you people only make judgments on the biased, bigoted news reports you religiously watch. How about actually living here surrounded by illegal immigrants, being scared sometimes to even go into a store simply because of the way they act towards citizens. You have no idea.

  2. Oloff Hammeraxe
    May 4, 2010 at 11:50 pm

    afraid of brown people, gotcha, McG.

  3. Driver's license is good enough
    May 4, 2010 at 11:59 pm

    McG,

    I live here in Phoenix, surrounded by Latino immigrants. The vast majority are here legally. I have an idea.

    The way they “act towards citizens” (you) is probably the same way you act towards them, aloof and suspicious. If you treated “citizens” (white people) the same way, you’d get the same back.

    Supporting this law because you are frightened and distrustful of people and things you don’t understand is the real bigotry here.

    To put it bluntly, you are a foolish racist, and one of many embarrassments to this beautiful state.

  4. May 5, 2010 at 11:46 am

    McG :

    Ya know, you people only make judgments on the biased, bigoted news reports you religiously watch. How about actually living here surrounded by illegal immigrants, being scared sometimes to even go into a store simply because of the way they act towards citizens. You have no idea.

    Ahem. I’ve been living here for 16 years. I do have an idea. The very fact that your comment speaks of “you people” and you made a snap judgment (a wrong one that was easily checked) that “you people” had no experience of Arizona indicates that you probably tend to jump to judgments regarding other things …. like skin color, for example.

  5. Reason
    May 5, 2010 at 9:09 pm

    I think no one will admit we don’t really want illegals here. Would slowing the stream of illegals really be that bad. The influx is astounding. I don’t want my tax dollars used to take care of people who aren’t citizens. If their is that much of a back log of citizenship, then slow it down. Also, this law would also technically includes ANY illegal immigrant. It just so happens that “brown people” are the largest concentration of illegals is in those areas. European immigrants are white. Australian immigrants are white. If they were overpopulating Arizona, it would apply to them, too. This has nothing to do with race.

    And “you people” does not automatically mean racism. What you’re doing is confusing a pop culture quip with reality. Sheesh.

  6. Michael Fugate
    May 5, 2010 at 9:45 pm

    Reason,
    This has everything do with race – how do you think law enforcement will make decisions – will they question the citizenship of everyone they stop for a speeding ticket or seatbelt violation?

    Your tax dollars are taking care of millions of noncitizens given our military adventures all over the world. They are also going for aid in Haiti, drug eradication in Columbia and consider all the military hardware we are dumping in Israel – well really everywhere. The costs for immigrants coming here to work are small in comparison.

    NAFTA and its counterpart “free” trade agreements farther south and our drug policies have played a large role in the movement of individuals across borders. Immigrants are not the criminals.

  7. May 5, 2010 at 10:45 pm

    Reason :

    European immigrants are white. Australian immigrants are white. If they were overpopulating Arizona, it would apply to them, too. This has nothing to do with race.

    And “you people” does not automatically mean racism. What you’re doing is confusing a pop culture quip with reality. Sheesh.

    There are a sizable number of European illegal immigrants here in the US (the East Coast has plenty of them who have arrived on tourist visas but never returned). But given their skin color, they won’t be challenged under the law. To imagine they would be (as they should be) is to be naive. Unlike you (I’m surmising), I’ve been living in Arizona since 1994 and find little basis for your claim that Hispanics are “overpopulating” Arizona. And the claim that “people who aren’t citizens” are costing you a significant amount of money also has little basis. As Michael pointed out, you’re already paying out way more coinage to support folks in other countries, all in the name of “democracy”.

    Look, as a legal immigrant into this country I have to deal with all the bureaucracy and bullshit that goes with being such. However, I see this law as what it is – pandering to the racist impulses of certain constituencies. As I pointed out to students last week, I was probably the only person in the room who could immediately (and sufficiently) prove that they were in the country legally. I won’t ever be asked to do so because I’m pale-skinned. The whole system is racially biased. An example: Twelve years ago, when I was getting fingerprinted at the INS, despite calling my Anglo name, the worker reached to fingerprint my wife who is dark-skinned in coloration but American. She must have looked like an immigrant, I guess.

    McG’s comment was not a “pop culture quip” – if you read the whole of it, he was clearly painting with a broad brush: “you people only make judgments on the biased, bigoted news reports you religiously watch”. That’s what I was calling them on.

  8. Michael Fugate
    May 6, 2010 at 1:19 pm

    Not to mention that humans have lived in Arizona for at least 15,000 years and many groups moved freely across the artificial borders of modern states and countries until recent times.

  9. May 6, 2010 at 10:32 pm

    Michael Fugate :

    Not to mention that humans have lived in Arizona for at least 15,000 years

    I’m guessing that many of the supporters of the bill (given the demographics on these sorts of issues) think that the earth is 10,000 or so years old, so I call shenanigans on your claim.

  10. John
    May 7, 2010 at 12:46 am

    Reason :
    I think no one will admit we don’t really want illegals here. Would slowing the stream of illegals really be that bad. The influx is astounding. I don’t want my tax dollars used to take care of people who aren’t citizens. If their is that much of a back log of citizenship, then slow it down. Also, this law would also technically includes ANY illegal immigrant. It just so happens that “brown people” are the largest concentration of illegals is in those areas. European immigrants are white. Australian immigrants are white. If they were overpopulating Arizona, it would apply to them, too. This has nothing to do with race.
    And “you people” does not automatically mean racism. What you’re doing is confusing a pop culture quip with reality. Sheesh.

    it’s called (blind) xenophobia, bro
    they will see someone white and let him in easy, but after they know he’s from australia, europe, etc… they will act as racists

  11. Robert Frost
    May 7, 2010 at 5:50 pm

    The fact of the matter remains that the majority of illegal immigrants in Arizona are Mexicans have brown skin. This we cam regard as a fact. Illegal immigrants are a bitter/sweet combination because they’re willing to work for less but unfortunately, this undercuts legal workers and citizens because, not only does it depress the minimum wage but it also creates more undocumented crime. When people are running around like ghosts and shadows without any legal right to be here, then they should leave — regardless of their skin color.

    Are you racially sensitive people suggesting that rounding up 20 guys in front of Home Depot is racist? Is it not obvious that they’re looking for work illegally? Do they even need to be brown for law enforcement to recognize this? I don’t think so. For you to suggest that this legislation is racist is beyond ridiculous.

    I don’t live in Arizona but I live in Texas and there is also a huge problem here. If the economy relies upon illegal immigrant workers than I suppose the economy will have to be rebuilt the right and legal way. That’s just the way it is. You guys calling the first commenter a racist shows just how stupid you really are. In my experience, the only people offended by racism ARE the racist people.

  12. 4est
    May 7, 2010 at 10:46 pm

    I think it unfortunate that it’s really both cases at once. It is a necessary thing that the state be run for the benefit of tax paying citizens, and so it should do all that is necessary to keep non-taxpaying (Illegal) members of society from the fruits of that labor (Charity aside). As unpleasant as it is it should be done.

    Arizona also has a unique demographic that makes this a very white vs. brown thing, and the bigots have stepped out of the wood work to take advantage of the situation above.

    The reality of the situation is that the legal (white) residents form a majority while those of questionable status (brown) are spread among both legal and illegal. Of course there will be profiling by police officers, because what’s the odds that a white or black man are going to be illegal persons in that particular area?

  13. Nana Lenore
    May 15, 2010 at 3:38 pm

    Non-taxpaying doesn’t necessarily equal illegal. The vast majority of immigrants, legal and otherwise, come here to work. And they do, many many at jobs where income tax and other taxes are withheld from their salaries. And every time a person, legal or otherwise, purchases a taxable item, they are paying the tax on it. And, I have seen almost no mention of the fact that Arizona, New Mexico, Texas and California were once part of Mexico, and that Hispanics were living in these areas long before any Anglos arrived. As Native Americans were living from Alaska to the tip of South America before “white” people arrived.

    The panic about criminal activity being brought into the United States by Hispanics reminds me a great deal of the feelings toward Italians 75 or so years ago. And the discrimination against the Irish, Central Europeans, and many of the other ethnic groups that have immigrated to the United States in the past 150 or 200 or so years.

    Just so you know, most of my ancestors arrived in the United States nearly 400 years ago. And were greatly instrumental in taking it away from the people who had been living here for thousands of years.

  14. Slarty Bartfast
    May 16, 2010 at 1:57 am

    I’m also an Arizonan, and what has bothered me perhaps more than anything is the way so many ‘media folk’ (because “attention whores’ sounds so bad and probably isn’t true in every case) have so quickly over-simplified the situation all the way down to “the police in AZ are racists and fools and cain’t hep theyselves from racial profiling ebry brown (but not dark-brown) person they meets’.

    For what it’s worth, here’s my two cents.

    Racial profiling may or may not occur, but the results will almost certainly LOOK like racial profiling, especially to those with a predisposition to seeing things that way. SB 1070’s requirement to produce proof of legal residency on demand will most likely never be allowed to take effect, as most legal scholars seem to think it won’t survive the many challenges that are and will be thrown up in it’s way. The current system for emigrating legally into the United States is woefully broken (or swamped, take your pick), and God help you if you are trying to do it legally after having gotten caught trying it illegally even one time before. There is a potentially-huge financial burden being borne by Arizona and other border states, that many folk, especially those who live outside these states, appear to be blind to, willfully or otherwise. These burdens include the publicly-funded education of citizen children of non-citizen parents (except here in AZ, where the state no longer supports the concept of publicly-funded education); the use of the public healthcare system as non-citizens’ primary-care providers (Press Ganey’s 2009 Pulse Report listed AZ as 48th in the country for average wait times in hospital EDs, at 355 minutes, or almost 6 hours); the costs of housing and caring for illegal immigration prisoners, for which the federal government is supposed to reimburse the states, and for which it does at the rate of pennies on each state dollar spent; and many more. Finally, contrary to what our arch-Conservative legislature and state representatives would like us to believe, according to the FBI’s most recent violent crime statistics, Arizona’s violent-crime rate has been going down since the late 90’s, not up. The very real drug violence in Mexico does not appear to be spilling over into Arizona.

    I’m guessing here, but I don’t think SB 1070 is the BEST solution to the problem of illegal immigration. I’m also guessing that most border-state residents would express dissatisfaction with the job the Feds have done dealing with the issues causing and surrounding illegal immigration. So why don’t I hear anybody suggesting a BETTER way of handling this complex issue? Debating the merits (or lack of same) of this law is a good thing, but it isn’t solving anything, and this is a problem that needs some kind of solution. If you don’t like SB 1070, then let’s hear your better ideas.

    And if all you have to offer is complaints, then please don’t get upset if you get dismissed, as someone with nothing helpful to say.

  15. AZ. Joe
    May 22, 2010 at 2:27 am

    I ‘am sick and tired of all “YOU PEOPLE” Here’s the facts. It is against Federal law to enter the United States of America without proper documentation period.Arizona is simply making an effort to uphold and enforce that LAW.You speak of RACIAL profiling, why is that a problem now ? I don’t hear you complaining when you fill out a job application and you mark African American or Hispanic (although you are being PROFILED) you accept it because you know that employers are under pressure to hire minorities! Clowns and hypocrites you are. Every time you come in contact with law enforcement personnel you are being PROFILED like it or not, it is their job to determine what type of individual they are dealing with. Now as for migrating to OUR country there is no more space for you…. Go back to YOUR crap country and do something positive to make it a better place. Our fore fathers and ancestors spilled their blood and sacrificed their lives for OUR FREEDOMS. Something that illegals are taking away. I have nothing against Mexicans, they are hard working,family oriented,God fearing people, but that does not give them the right to enter our country illegally, just as we cannot enter their country illegally. We as American citizens know that if we travel abroad we can be asked to show our visa/passport at any given time and failure to do so most likely will result in incarceration until documentation is produced. Why should it be different here?Is that considered RACIAL PROFILING? NO! Its called looking out for the best interest of the people of your community. I guess when you get right down to it, sorry for the inconvenience but we need to protect our cities,states,and country but most of all the LEGAL citizens of the UNITED STATES of AMERICA. SB 1070 is mild in-comparison to how illegals should be dealt with, but there are too many cry babies here to deal with that subject at this time. It’s OUR country people stand up and fight or get out of the way, the real change is coming………

  16. May 22, 2010 at 11:59 am

    Wow. Or should I say “WOW”.

    Let’s first ignore the implication that everyone objecting is African-American or Hispanic. They’re not. In fact, I’m willing to say that the majority of objectors tick off “White/Caucasian”.

    Now let’s imagine the following being said back in 1620:

    “Go back to YOUR crap country and do something positive to make it a better place. Our fore fathers and ancestors spilled their blood and sacrificed their lives for OUR FREEDOMS.I have nothing against Puritans, they are hard working,family oriented,God fearing people, but that does not give them the right to enter our country illegally.”

    See how that works?

    And then there is:

    We as American citizens know that if we travel abroad we can be asked to show our visa/passport at any given time and failure to do so most likely will result in incarceration until documentation is produced.

    You haven’t traveled much, have you?

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